everybody’s a critic.(c) BK
тема всплыла обсуждении фика Createress - Помрачение сознания
тут pay.diary.ru/~QAF-fanclub/p129788018.htm?from=l...
про ДР Джастина - я полазила по буржуйскому фандому, кроме фраз типа, ме не знаем когда у джастина др, ничего толкового не нашла
водительское удостоверение, которое запостила в обсуждении фика ula всплывало как-то, причем с утверждением, что это из съемочного реквизита... я в общем-то в это верю, и как ни смешно, в основном из-за ляпов на нем, типа не соответствующей фотке и карему цвету глаз)) (фанатки в своем творчестве такого просера не допустили бы, особенно касаемо цвета глаз, имхо)) а вот коулип вполне могли, тем более, что видимо это и не планировалось использовать крупным планом и
но в общем-то это все домыслы, если у кого есть какая инфа или соображения по этому поводу, буду рада услышать) потому что... кто считает, что оно в декабре, кто-то в ноябре, причем согласно таймлайну первого сезона, и я тупо не понимаю пока, как это у них выходит)
а да, вот оно удостоверение читать дальше
теперь что касается таймлайна, я сама никогда не вникала, отчасти лень было, отчасти и не хотелось, потому что я уверена, бреда и нестыкачей там навалом) довольно часто упоминается например беременность мел, не раз ее пытались рассчитать и состыковать со всем остальным
и пока я сегодня лазила, наткнулась на такое вот хм... иссследование darla-isabelle.livejournal.com/1792.html, читать даже еще и не пробовала, оно устрашающей длины, и естественно на англ), и даже не уверена, хватит ли у меня заинтересованности это осилить, но пусть будет))) хотя мож там и полная чушь)
помятуя, как исчезают впезапну сайты и журналы, запощу его сюда целиком
читать дальше
I was bored today so I decided to clean up my hard drive a bit and I found this little essay on the Queer as Folk timeline from a year or so ago. I never got around to posting it anywhere because I didn’t have an LJ then and the discussion boards I did know were pretty much dead by the time I found the show, so once I’d typed it up and gotten it out of my system, I forgot all about it.
As questions on the matter seem to pop up here regularly though, I figured I’d throw it out here now. Enjoy or shake your head.
Preamble & Season One
I’d been thinking about the continuity issues and trying to make things work for some time, but these parts of two commentaries by Gael on Refugee are what got me going on this little epic:
“Dear Continuity Squad: Season 3 is now over and it’s safe to come back from vacation. You have no more work to avoid. And since CowLip themselves wrote the Finale as usual, I guess we must ask THEM also to go back and review their own television series and familiarize themselves with what has actually occurred on it. I know that’s a lot to ask, but I do it and I’m not even getting PAID to get stuff correct! So, Jason Kemp, AKA Dumpster Boy, was murdered on April 11, 2002 according to the ad from “Concerned Citizens for the Truth” (AKA Brian “Rage” Kinney). That was Episode 2.10, the one where the future Rage goes a bit psycho himself. Except - that episode seems to have taken place in the fall of 2001. In 2.07 Lindsay and Mel are out raking leaves, so it must be fall, and then in 2.09 everyone is wearing heavier coats. And right after the finding of Dumpster Boy, there’s the White Party and the redundant Lesbian Wedding in Episode 2.11, when it is winter. Then in 2.12 Deb and Jennifer try to find out Dumpster Boy’s name as they scramble around snowy streets. This is a while after the murder, yet Horvath says nothing about the investigation being suspended because it obviously wasn’t. In fact, the case is on the Open Board, as Debbie points out to Carl. Then comes the supposed simultaneous birthdays of Ben and Justin (not to be confused with Justin’s OTHER birthday when he turned 18 in Decem-ber 2000, Episode 1.14). And since Ben has stated that he’s a Pisces, that would make it mid-March at the very latest. Then there is 2.17, Spring Break, and canceled snowboarding in Ver-mont - and it STILL can’t be April of 2002 yet. So if Jason Kemp really WAS killed on April 11, 2002 - then in what year did those things that came afterwards take place? I mean, even with the S3 Finale, we have NO fcking clue as to what month it is. A few episodes back Ted’s compu-ter stated that it was February 2, 2003. But other fans insist that it must be November 2002 - or is it 2003? - because of the Election. Or is it actually one year after Rikert, AKA Psycho Cop, resigned, as the “Concerned Citizens for the Truth” ad states, making it the coldest, snowiest MAY in Pittsburgh history? We have NO clue. The anniversary of the prom has gone by at least once without mention, we have no idea how long Justin and the Plot Device were shacked up, and Gus’ birthday must have passed as well - Gus has to be way beyond two years old now. Liberty Avenue truly MUST be Oz, where Time has no meaning - except when it’s vital to the plot (those Trimester things don’t just happen out of the blue!). Sort of.”
“Oh, one more thing. Vic died in February, which means that Brian found out he had cancer and had his surgery in February. Figure about four weeks of radiation treatment, so it’s probably late March. What football league plays its games in March? It CAN’T be fall already. What year IS it again? And how long has Mel been pregnant? Fifteen months? Twenty? Is she having an elephant? I’m just asking! CowLip’s Continuity Squad has been on permanent vacation since S1, but now it’s getting ridiculous. Outlining the plot ahead of time would help, guys. Or looking at a calendar now and then. The viewers are willing to suspend disbelief, but only to a point. Continuity is already a joke among dedicated fans, but now even casual viewers like my sister are asking, “WTF? What season is it supposed to be?” This isn’t merely sloppy planning, it’s almost willful flaunting of the Laws of Time and Space. Unless this is “Queer as Folk: The Sci-Fi Version”?”
So, here’s my take on the subject. It’s based on what actually happens on the show more than on the dates we are given every now and then, so when in doubt, I usually dismissed the ‘official’ time. I don’t really feel bad about that, as they’re so often out of the blue or worse, contradicting each other, that it’s practically necessary if you want the final product to make any sense.
(I’m sorry to base this mostly on what happens with Brian and Justin, but that’s what I remember most clearly – I’d have to re-watch everything thoroughly in order to get it correctly and detailed for the other characters as well.)
Okay, enough of the prologue, here goes.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
I’ll keep my commentary on season one short, as that was pretty obvious and coherent. Episode 1.01 first aired in December 2000 and was supposed to be set at the start of the new school year, so I guess we can say the general consensus is that it starts out in early September 2000.
From there we watch as the weather gets colder, the leaves fall, pumpkins appear for Halloween, Lindsay’s obligatory two months maternity leave near their close, and when Michael announces in 1.13 that ‘it’s December’ it mostly just confirms our own calculations. After 1.14 there is a break for (possibly the P-Town trip), Christmas and New Year’s, after the Leather Ball ‘a couple of weeks’ go by in which Brian – and everyone else, apparently - doesn’t see Lindsay, so by the time Michael and David get back from Paris in 1.17 we’re well into February, probably past Valentine's Day.
I’d say there’s another gap between Brian’s father’s funeral in 1.19 and the King of Babylon contest in 1.20 – the latter taking place on March 31. according to the poster – which places the prom firmly in mid to late April 2001.
Nothing new there.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Season Two
There have been many complaints about continuity and the unclear time frame of season three, but I actually think these continuity problems already start with season two. The trouble here is not so much that it doesn’t make sense in and of itself, but that it throws over pretty much everything we learned in season one, which was pretty clear and straightforward. Just a few examples....
The second season already starts fucking up the time line at the very beginning with Gus’s birthday. I mean, Gus’s birth in 1.01 was supposed to be in early to mid-September 2000, right? Now let’s do a little math: As far as we know, the prom took place in April 2001, let’s be generous and say it was late April. Then we have two weeks in coma and a month in rehab – makes it mid-June when Justin got out of the hospital in 2.01. There is enough time for him to run off and see Brian, for them to get comfortable enough together again that Brian drops by Jen’s condo to see Justin and help with his physical therapy, for Jen to ask Brian to leave, for Justin to get impatient and confused and go to see Brian again, figure out what happened and freak out, for his problems to get bad enough for Jen to reconsider and ask Brian to take him, for Justin to move into the loft, for Brian to ask for help and for a few failed attempts to get Justin’s memory back.
What do you say how long that took? Two or three weeks at the very most? So we have early July 2001 now. What were they celebrating, Gus’s name-day? The anniversary of the baby shower? And it’s not even that they just scratched a couple of months off the calendar; there are still two summer holiday episodes before college starts in 2.05 in what would be the beginning of September 2001, right? Still not quite time for Gus’s birthday just yet.
To be picky: In 2.03 (I decided it’s late July or early August now, so Pride can be mid to mid-late August to fit with 2.05 being the beginning of September – Justin also seems to be a bit better now – back in public and working at the diner) Mel and Linds say it is their first year on the GLC board – but when they mentioned being on the board in 1.06 (mid-October 2000) it sure didn’t sound like they were new there. I know it still fits when their first year is nearly over now, but it still seems a bit off to me to mention it now. Not exactly sure why.
(Oh and I guess the annual two week Novotny outing to the Poconos took place in the few weeks between 2.02 and 2.03? Or they skipped it because of circumstances? The year before it must have been skipped in favor of Italy as well. Or it wasn’t invented yet? Yeah, probably that one.)
Episodes 2.06 to 2.08 don’t seem to cover more than a few days each, without gaps worth mentioning between them - and I also don’t recall any information contradicting what we already know – Michael meets Ben, Ted sets up JerkAtWork, Emmett becomes a porn star and meets George Schickel, the girls are planning their marriage and trying to get the Petersons’ support, and Justin sets up the rules and breaks them - so nothing really to say here in terms of time and continuity.
Then comes 2.09 and Joanie. Jack’s funeral in 1.19 was supposed to be in, well, some say around Valentine’s day because some drugstore had some flowers on display, personally I always figured it was more like early March; anyway, the point is that it was in late winter. 2.09 is supposed to take place in the fall – when 2.05 marks the beginning of September, it must be October by now (maybe the leaves were falling early that year). Brian has to be told that Joan is drinking more since Jack died, so I guess that means he hasn’t seen her in the seven months since then. So why would Brian say the last time they met was on Christmas? I mean, I could come up with some explanations if I wanted to. Like... it was some kind of nasty inside joke that being finally freed of Jack must be like Christmas for Joanie. Or him. Or both of them. After all, he also told Claire that Joan’s increased drinking must mean she’s celebrating, so it could be more of the same here. Or maybe... it’s just that Christmas is usually the only time he shows up at his ‘home’ (to torture himself for a bit) and he’s telling his mother that he has no intention to change that? But then, what about Joan’s remark that she won’t see Brian for another six months? Christmas is only two months away, isn’t it?
I mean, ignoring Brian’s comment (which I’ve decided to do), it would kind of fit with the actual timeline, tell us that this is probably the rhythm of their meetings (twice a year, when something is up), and also tell us that Joanie doesn’t actually expect to see Brian on Christmas. Cause counting both their remarks and taking them at face value would mean it’s June now, and that doesn’t make any sense at all. (Even though it would fit with the ‘Flag Day’ remark, but I refuse to take some cheap joke into consideration.)
(How come we’ve never had a Christmas or other holiday on screen anyway, even if only mentioned in passing?)
Next we have Jason Kemp’s murder in 2.10 and the wedding and White Party in 2.11. I looked up the official site of the Miami White Party and it apparently takes place in mid to late November (at least now), so it almost fits. (I can still pretend that seven years ago it used to take place in late October or early November, right?)
So... Debbie identified Jason Kemp in 2.12, what we’re supposed to believe was about two weeks after 2.10 and obviously shortly before the case was closed for ‘lack of evidence’. Was Rikert going to Stockwell a reaction to his victim being identified and panicking, and Stockwell didn’t know anything about what happened while the crime was initially investigated?
2.13 actually brings up two... well, let’s say questions. The first one is about Justin’s college tuition, which his father refuses to pay for anymore. I looked up some colleges and apparently tuition for the spring semester is due on December 1. – but with the possibility of monthly payments. I decided that Craig informed Justin – or rather, Jen – on very short notice in mid November, so Justin has time to play the go-go-boy for a good week or two before coming to his senses and accepting Brian’s help just on time. (I like that theory, please don’t confuse me with facts – that is, if you can talk of facts in the QAF-world.)
The second, much more convoluted one is the sudden appearance of Michael’s real father – including the moving of his birthday. Michael’s 30. birthday in episode 1.11 was in November, right? (I distinctly remember Michael himself stating that it was December only two episodes later, reacting to Emmett’s See The Light ‘Spring cleaning’ in 1.13; and I still trust those kinds of comments from season one. Come to think of it, he should be turning 31 right about now.)
So according to that, Michael would have been born in November 1970. And now we are supposed to believe that it was in March 1970? Not only does that not make sense with the established timeline that existed in the first season, it would also make Michael more than a year older than Brian (who was born in April 1971 last time we heard about it [1.22]) instead of just a few months – they wouldn’t even have been in the same year at high school. Unless, of course, Michael had to repeat a year, which doesn’t seem too unlikely. Still, why couldn’t Danny have left town just after the prom – that is in April, right? Even if Debbie already suspected or probably knew by then – she was sixteen or seventeen (and Catholic) and might not have worked up the courage to tell him - or anyone else – yet, so it would be at least just as believable as ‘he stayed over the summer after his graduation because... whatever.’ (At least, I assume he graduated. Did Debbie? What were the conditions/possibilities for pregnant high school students at the time?)
Then we have 2.14 with Justin’s acceptance of Brian’s financial support, George Schickel’s death and Debbie’s date with Horvath, and 2.15 with the comic book disaster, so according to my timeline it’s around mid to later December by 2.16 – which for once actually fits with something established in season one: It’s Justin’s birthday again. (I’ve decided to discount the Pisces [Feb 20. – Mar 20.] information about Ben – you can’t believe everything they say on this show anyway or it would make even less sense, especially timeline and continuity-wise.)
We then skip Christmas 2001, New Year’s Eve (both: again!) and obviously January (with the Police Ball mentioned in 4.11) and February (with a presumably ignored Valentine's Day) as well, as it is already spring break in 2.17. I looked up the current academic calendars of some colleges and apparently, Spring break is in early March. Apparently there is still snow in Vermont then.
(I considered that Brian may have misspoken and meant Christmas or winter break, but that didn’t seem to make too much sense in the big picture either so I decided to go with the flow this time. Even though I think that after two months the comic and birthday debacles should have been resolved and not still linger so near the surface for Justin. Then again, we’re talking about Brian and Justin here.)
But there’s still another problem: The other characters’ storylines seem to pick up pretty much where they left off as well, so there’s no real evidence for such a big gap. Like: Emmett finds out about his inheritance from George only now? And Ben seems to be okay with his new cocktail (the one he got after his birthday) so far. How long does it take to have a bad reaction? (Ok, the Pisces thing would probably fit here... how inconvenient.) Maybe Brian and Justin just live in another time zone than anybody else. Just like we always suspected.
2.18 obviously starts a week after 2.17 ended. Brian’s job sucks right now, Justin participates in a student art exhibition that Brian apparently doesn’t have time to visit (even though I sometimes wonder whether Justin told him about it in the first place, seeing where their relationship stands right now – he might be afraid of another disappointment); Ben collapses and is in a critical condition for some time before being released from the hospital; and Emmett loses the inheritance. So by the end of the episode it must be at least mid March 2002.
I suspect that the affair with Ethan goes on for a week, or maybe two at the most (I don’t base that on anything, really) before 2.19 starts (end of March) and then everything seems to happen really fast. I don’t think it’s much later than early April 2002 by the end of 2.20. (So theoretically, the snow while Ethan plays in front of the diner should be the last one for at least six months. From now on, I will ignore the weather for the time being.)
(Also, Debbie brings up the summer outing for the first time when she invites Ben to join them – it doesn’t really matter that it seems to be a bit early to bring it up the way she does because it’s never mentioned again.)
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Season Three
Continuity troubles seem to start big time with season three, so I will try to make some semblance of sense of that. (A pre-requisite of that seems to be to discount everything to do with the weather, which I’m determined to do – it’s not my fault that they seem to be shooting only in winter. I mean, not even Toronto can be covered in snow all year, right?)
3.01 covers the week following the Rage party, ending with the day or day after Mel and Linds’ eighth anniversary party (which would put their seventh anniversary somewhere around 1.21/1.22, so I guess it’s not too surprising we didn’t hear about it with everything else going on then); and in 3.02 Justin starts worrying about his tuition – which should be due by May 1. for the summer semester 2002. (Brian’s 31. birthday and the prom anniversary should fall in about that time – why was Brian already 31 in 2.18 again?)
(Also: I thought Mel and Linds were the first ones in their group of friends to have a kid and now Dusty’s already having her third? As far as I remember she wasn’t even the one who had one in 1.13 – and she seems to have been babysitting Gus from rather early on, so she can’t really be that new of a friend either.)
3.03 has the annual Center Carnival I can’t remember having heard of before (ok, alright, the last one would have happened while Justin was in coma so it actually fits this time) and the beginning of the steroid storyline; 3.04 has nephew John, and Ted and Emmett moving in together; and 3.05 starts the Stockwell storyline and the decline of Justin and Ethan’s relationship.
All of those seem pretty straightforward, so I go with roughly a good week per episode (including in-between-episode time) again – so it should be mid to late May now.
By 3.06 Justin seems to have had some time to (talk himself into believing to?) accept Ethan’s decision and be supportive and happy for him over the first concert he’s booked for, while Stockwell starts to interfere with the non-family-friendly aspects of Liberty Avenue. With 3.07 pretty much starting the following morning and apparently not covering more then two or three days, I’d say it’s early June now. Meaning, in my world Justin was with Ethan for about two months. (And unless the baby comes very early, it should be born in early March 2003.)
In 3.08 there are two references to time that don’t contradict each other: Ted hasn’t been out ‘for weeks’ and Justin has been depressed for the entire ‘first month’s rent’ – so I guess it’s save to say it’s July by now. Also, Lindsay is finally back to work, meaning that – apart from the few weeks she and Melanie were apart in season one – she was home with Gus for two months short of two years.
(So has the Novotny clan been to the Poconos sometime in that month? Sorry, I don’t know why I keep coming back to that darn family vacation. Oh, and Pride should have fallen in that time, too - unless it's supposed to happen in late August like the previous year, but we don't hear anything about it then, either.)
In the following episodes, for the rest of the season really, the characters keep dealing with the same storylines: Ted’s giving up and drug addiction with Emmett reacting to it, Mel’s pregnancy and how it impacts her professional and domestic life, Ben and Michael dealing with Hunter and Brian and Justin dealing with Stockwell.
What this means for me in terms of building a timeline is that for one, there are no greater gaps between the episodes to take into account (like recovering from steroids before taking in a hustler; or finding out what you want now in contrast to what you expected before, before going for it), so we can more or less see the episodes in ‘real time’ – I’d say about a week to ten days for each.
Roughly six to eight weeks from early to mid July would be somewhere between mid August and mid September. Taking into account the trimester thing it must be early September in 3.14. And we’re still in 2002.
Gus is about to turn two (yes, Brian says he’s two in 3.07, but it’s June then and what’s three month, right? Or did Gus even keep his season two birthday of early July?) and Brian and Justin’s second anniversary is coming up with it - maybe that was when they decided they were partners; Justin was suspended right before the start of the fall semester of his second year, which would have been paid for by August 1. (just before Brian lost his job) and Hunter went back to high school pretty much at the beginning of the new school year. (I think he might have gone to school part time while he was still living with his parents despite the hustling and also before he ran away from foster care, so maybe he didn’t completely miss several years.)
(And: are mayoral elections always in November everywhere in the US or does it vary? Maybe the former mayor had to retire earlier for some unknown reasons and it wasn’t even a regular election year?)
(That also makes Daphne’s mid-terms in 3.12 her summer finals – has Justin finished his classes and handed in his projects? Possibly before he started the internship? And did he get any intermediate reports from Vangard after working the time required for every single one of the three credits he needed before he got fired? After that he obviously wouldn’t have gotten any credits from PIFA at all, but they may have come in handy later. Sorry, I digress.)
I know I’m ignoring pretty much all the dates given but really: how could you not? For example, Ted’s e-mails in 3.10 are allegedly from February 2. This date may show hints of continuity in a purely later-season-three-referring-to-something-we-may-or-may-not-have-accepted-from-season-two context, as Brian was mentioning Justin's birthday like it wasn't too far away in 3.09, and that was supposedly in February or March (Pisces) then; but then in 4.07, it’s supposed to be February again. But from 3.14 to 4.14 it’s only six months (the time Ted is sober). And from 3.07 to 4.14 it should be nine months (Mel’s pregnancy).
[Actually, Stephmck brought it to my attention that you have to be pregnant for at least a month before it shows on a test, so theoretically it should be only two months from 3.07 to the end of the first trimester in 3.14, one of which would be consumed by the gap between 3.07 and 3.08. I don't think that it's realistic for the whole second half of the third season to have taken place within one month. On the other hand it also doesn't seem that between the end of 3.05 - Michael delivering his sperm - and 3.07 - the confirmation of the pregnancy - a month or more passed; I don't think it was more than two weeks at the very most. So we came to the conclusion that CowLip have no clue what they're talking about and wanted us to believe that Mel found out she was pregnant after hardly a couple of weeks, and I'm now consciously ignoring biology in favor of a sensible timeline.]
Same for the dates in the anti-Stockwell ad. They are precise dates, but they don’t make any sense at all. Jason Kemp was killed in April 2002? The investigation stopped and Rikert retired in May 2002? And now it’s May 2003? In season two it was pretty clear that the murder happened in later October 2001. Maybe it was cold-cased about a month later – after Debbie got them a lead by finding out his name and Rikert confessed to Stockwell? - and yes, that’s now nearly a year ago, but where they got the dates is beyond me. (Oh, I know: When they were shooting the anti-Stockwell ad for 3.14 it was April/May 2003 and as the crime took place last season, it must have been a year ago. That seems to be the way of thinking on several occasions....)
So what are we to make of all that? Well, what I make of it is that: The writers, CowLip, TPTB, whoever is responsible tell their stories in about real time pace, but then forget that they only covered a few months. When they come back for the next season, or even only were away for a certain number of episodes, they somehow think that every season covers a whole year – so as the series started in September 2000, an episode close to or at the end of the third season must logically take place in late Winter or Spring 2003 – no matter how much time actually passed within the story. (Could you say they mix up external and internal story time? That sounds so...educated? Or maybe telling time and told time. Whatever the phrase is.)
So when you want to know what time it is in the story, you pretty much have to ignore all the references to actual dates, as they seem to refer to real life time more than story time. References to time frames seem to be slightly more reliable, at least when they’re not about several years like Mel and Lindsay’s anniversaries.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
And here comes the second part:
Season Four
I guess while I’m at it I could just as well go on for the remaining two seasons – even though they seem to be slightly less confusing.
According to Deb in 4.01 it’s been three days since Michael ran off with Hunter in the season three finale, so there’s no gap worth mentioning between these to seasons either. In 4.02 Debbie’s tells Ted that she’d ‘love to stay for the whole seven days’, so however credible or incredible such a speedy release may be, it’s a week from 3.14 now – about mid-September 2002.
In 4.03 the whole Pink Posse business starts and Brian finds office space, and in 4.04 Ted is in his sixth week of rehab – a good five weeks after 3.14 would be about early to mid October and about three weeks after 4.03 – enough time to more or less set up Kinnetik.
4.05 marks the end of the Cody arc and Kinnetik getting started seriously, and then there seems to be a little gap before 4.06: Ben can’t find a publisher for his new book, Mel’s case is over, Emmett has moved in with Debbie and she still isn’t talking to Vic, Justin – and his relationship with Brian – have recovered from the Pink Posse, and Kinnetik has had a very a very successful start and is paying enough already for Brian to repay his debt to the community. I’d say... about four weeks? Which makes it... mid November. 2002.
(I guess we could make it four months just as well – that would fit with Vic dying in February. Except that it seems a bit long for Vic and Deb to be at odds. And would make Mel’s pregnancy really long. So personally, I’ll stick with the four weeks. Oh, and Mel and Linds’ first wedding anniversary and Michael’s 32. birthday would also fall in this time.)
4.06 starts lightly and relaxed, the office party goes well, a Hollywood director states interest in Rage, Brian and Justin hang out in Babylon to celebrate while Brian still tries to get Justin to go back to school. Then suddenly we have Vic’s death, Brian’s banishment from Debbie’s house and the discovery of a lump while winning his bet to bring Justin back to school.
In 4.07 Brian is trying to deal with the cancer while Justin is back at school. That in itself isn’t really a problem – he was only suspended and the condition for his being allowed back is invalid now that Stockwell is ‘indicted’ – but it’s rather late in the fall semester (damn yes, it is!) so... he sure wont get any credits this term. But at least he’s back. It’s a start. (I guess he can sit in on classes he’s not sure he wants to take to see what they’re like and read up on subjects he knows he will take in the spring semester so maybe he can take more courses then and make up for some of the lost time. And work on general, non-class-bound projects. Whatever.)
As for my take on the February Christmas: I know on Vic’s gravestone (in 4.09) it says it’s 2004 already, but well, it also says he was born in 1951, which doesn’t make sense in any way, shape or form – not that that’s even possible at this point: On the one hand, Vic was supposed to be involved in the Stonewall riots and the first Pride march in New York while he was there working as a pastry chef and fully living the nightlife. Stonewall and Pride took place in 1969 and 1970 respectively, and to take an active part in the events – not to mention making his own living in Greenwich Village - I would expect him to be at the very least of legal age to hang out at the bar in the first place. Which means he should have been born in the mid to late 1940s.
On the other hand, Vic is supposed to be Debbie’s younger brother – and by several years if she was mothering him in their childhood already. Hm, let’s see... Debbie had Michael in 1970 (at least the year seems to be steady, even if the month varies) when according to episode 3.10 she was 17. That would make her year of birth 1953 - and Vic’s somewhere in the mid to late 1950s accordingly. Maybe someone noticed the mess, decided 1951 would be a good compromise and hoped no-one would notice. (And additionally: In 1.03, wasn’t Vic supposed to be born in 1952 according to his Babylon membership card?)
So with all that, I don’t really see a reason to put any more stock in his year of death – let alone the month. It seems to me that they ‘needed’ to give us some actual date, so they - again – referred to what time it was in real life instead of what would make sense story-wise.
By the time Brian gets back from Baltimore in 4.08 I expect it’s early December. A few days till Brian finds out Justin knows and kicks him out, another few days (4.09) till Justin gives up for the time being and the radiation treatment starts, and another few days in which Mikey gets rejected, clues Justin in to Brian’s motives and Justin gets back to the loft to stay.
Then we skip another few weeks – Justin’s 20. birthday, Christmas and the turn of the year; as well as the remainder of Brian’s radiation treatment and Justin getting him through it. I guess by 4.10 it’s about mid January 2003. (And I have just learned that there are even still football games until the end of January.)
By 4.11 I think at least another two weeks or so have passed – Brian seems to be better and can make jokes about ‘withholding sex’ again already.
4.12 follows rather seamlessly and then we supposedly have a three week gap before 4.13 (illogical as it seems that Justin would wait that long to find out what Brian was up to). So according to my personal timeline it’s later February by now and we've conveniently skipped another Valentine's Day. Calculating that 4.13 and 4.14 cover less than a week each it’s still early enough in March for Jenny Rebecca to be born a week or so early. (When ‘the baby isn’t due for weeks’ before the guys left for Toronto was supposed to mean two weeks or so....)
So in my world, season four ends in early to mid March 2003, which means season five should pick up in fall 2003.
[Actually, going with this timeline for Ben and Michael’s marriage instead of believing CowLip’s ‘Liberty Ride 2004’ unfortunately clashes with reality, as same-sex marriage wasn’t legal in Toronto/Ontario until June 2003, (first Canadian province to decide that, nationwide legalization July 2005), but I think I’ll overlook that….]
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Season Five
Hm… season four ends in March, when Keller has just gotten the green light for the Rage movie and now has to get the sсript written and actors cast and whatever else is necessary to prepare a movie, giving Justin some more time in Pittsburgh (in which he can finish the Spring semester) and putting his departure in about mid-April, probably leaving just before Brian’s 32. birthday and staying in Hollywood for a good six to seven months – long enough to see the apparent second extension coming -, so season five picks up in about early to mid-November 2003.
In contrast to the earlier seasons, season five as an entirety doesn’t really seem all that close-knit; although we also had some jumps here and there in seasons one to four, in season five it seems that such jumps are the rule instead of exceptions: most new developments – and there are some – in one episode seem to have a lot of time to become established matters of fact, even routines, before the next episode starts, indicating that some time has gone by, but making it hard to judge how much time actually passes during one, let alone between episodes.
Let’s start at the beginning. In 5.01 Ted informs us that Kinnetik has been in business for a year – which fits pretty well with the launch party in 4.06 – and allegedly it’s the girls’ 10. ‘being together’ anniversary – when the date fits so much better as their second wedding anniversary. (And their break-up would have happened about a month before their 9. anniversary.) Brian gets moody about (another?) extension of Justin’s absence and is half-heartedly searching for a new ‘toy’, finally going overboard and actually acquiring Babylon, and Justin enjoys Hollywood and making his vision become real. And then suddenly the Rage movie gets cancelled and the dream is over. In the meantime, Ben and Michael debate buying a house, and Michael should also be turning 33 somewhere around here. They also find out that Mel and Lindsay have been separated ever since Jenny’s birth and Michael throws himself in that righteous indignation that leads him right into the custody battle.
I give this episode at least a week, and another one between episode time, clearing out the studio, getting all the required contracts and licenses for Babylon signed, getting all Debbie and Horvath’s stuff back to Debbie’s house….
5.02 seems to start at the beginning of the week, leaving a few days to the re-opening of Babylon on Friday. Justin, after finally accepting that the Rage movie is definitely and irrevocably dead, seems to be back in Pittsburgh a day or two after that. Ted starts feeling old and unattractive and fights it by getting his hair bleached; and Michael gets a lawyer.
Then there seems to be a gap for Thanksgiving; and in 5.03 Emmett starts his new job as the Queer Guy, gets cancelled and then re-installed; Mel meets with her lawyer, decides her chances are better without Lindsay there, so Brian gets Linds her own lawyer and finally the custody hearing takes place; and after a few false starts, Babylon is ‘back on top’ again, while Justin still doesn’t have any specific plans for his immediate future other than that it doesn’t include school or the Liberty Diner.
5.04 seems to start at the very verge of Christmas – apparently, it’s been about four weeks since Justin moved in with Brian again, (obviously Justin’s comment about the four years doesn’t work with my estimations) – but neither that nor Justin’s 21. birthday or the turn of the year are mentioned; and the new year 2004 starts all shiny with the arrival of the custody decision. Michael doesn’t like it, accuses Brian of not being his friend and stops talking to him, he moves into the new house with Ben and doesn’t even show up at Brian’s piece offering of Hard Heroes Night even though Brian went to his dinner party. Debbie is already bored with staying at home, Ted takes off of work for ‘ten days tops’, and Justin works on getting a painting included in the Emerging Artists show at Lindsay’s gallery. I’d say by the end of the episode, it’s easily mid- to late January.
Then Michael, Mel and Linds get into a routine of passing Jenny Rebecca around and bitching at each other while Ben and Michael get comfortable in suburbia and Michael still refuses to talk to Brian. So 5.05 probably starts well into February, having Brian deal with syphilis - what a lovely Valentine's Day gift, Justin starting to think about what he wants in a relationship in the long run, while the custody situation escalates before finally getting resolved. Also, Deb has to deal with Loretta, and Ted with the results of his surgery.
I’m not sure how much time passes between episodes, but by 5.06 Debbie is back at the Diner, Michael and Justin have produced a new issue of Rage, and Hunter went from never wanting to go back to school again to the point of leaving Ben and Michael. Brian has to deal with the arrival of a new ‘hot stud’ and rejection, blowing it completely out of proportion and alienating Justin further. I’d say it’s at least mid, possibly even late March when the episode ends.
Let’s say 5.07 starts about two weeks later – Michael and Ben’s relationship is suffering from the loss of Hunter, and Proposition 14 has made its way to everyone’s awareness and is being fought with every available weapon. Lindsay moves in and out with her parents, Justin finally leaves Brian, camps out at Michael and Ben’s house and then finds his own place, Brian has another fight with Michael, bans Brandon from Babylon and then gets into a bet with him – and celebrates another depressing birthday we don’t hear about.
5.08 has the conclusion of the bet, Mel dating Corinne, everyone fighting Prop 14, Craig having Justin arrested and Drew contacting Emmett again. It’s hard to give an exact time frame, but I’ll go with more than a week.
By 5.09 Brian and Michael haven’t spoken for weeks and even Deb feels it’s time to intervene – I guess it must be at least mid-May by now. We learn that Jen has been in a relationship for the past six months (that’s since around the time Justin came back from Hollywood), and the Emerging Artists show finally takes place. Michael still refuses to make up with Brian; and Drew finally comes out. I’d say a good week for this episode as well, making it late May.
By 5.10 there’s a benefit planned, organized and about to happen that we haven’t heard about before and Ted is getting impatient and desperate to find someone to marry. I guess it’s mid-June by now. Brian is the first year cancer free and donates Babylon to host the benefit. I think the episode itself covers only several days, and 5.11 starts the morning after the explosion. The vigil is held the next day, Michael is recovering nicely, the police finish with Babylon, and Brian finds and buys a house and eventually convinces Justin to marry him. (And unless we go with 2.04 and assume that in QaF Verse Pittsburgh Pride is in late August, it should be right around the corner.)
By 5.12 Michael is out of the hospital and seems reasonably fine, Hunter is working at the Diner, Drew’s team is begging him to come back and they win the next game, Brian and Justin send out their announcements and plan their marriage at a rather exclusive location, the girls decide to move to Canada, Drew goes to explore his new freedom, and Ted meets Tad. And so passes another month.
When 5.13 starts, Ted has been with Tad for three weeks, so it must be mid-August 2004 now. The Human Rights Panel asks Michael to speak at some conference (where he finally gets that not everyone has to want the same things), Hunter passes what must be summer courses and can go on to the new school year with his class (and turns 18), Ted breaks up with Tad and celebrates his birthday with Emmett, and Brian and Justin decide not to get married. And then everyone leaves for new adventures. It seems fitting that it’s the end of summer.
I know that the final official date we were given was on the wedding invitations, where the commitment ceremony was announced for April 16. 2005 and the RSVP asked for by April 1. 2005. I think the year doesn’t bear too much weight in the context of building a sensible overall timeline, as there didn’t pass nearly as much time between the end of season two and the end of season four as was generally assumed later on, but the month could probably fit if one wanted it to. We don’t really know how much time Justin actually spent in LA, and the timeline I worked out for season five also leaves room to be tightened up. I just like it better this way.
As for Ted’s age, I know Ted said he was 33 in 1.11 (Nov. 2000), but even if I went with the so called official timeline – what there is of one - and have it be April 2005 now, he would still only be turning 38. As his age was only mentioned in a through-away remark in season 1, while being a major story point in season 5, I have decided to go against my usual practice and dismiss the season 1 date in favor of this later one and have Ted being born in August 1965, making him 35 years old in Season 1, and adding my own piece of continuity: according to Emmett in 4.14, Ted’s birthday really is in August. (Ok that doesn't seem to fit so well with the ski trip, but aren't there some mountains that are covered in snow year round? Up in Vermont, maybe?)
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
тут pay.diary.ru/~QAF-fanclub/p129788018.htm?from=l...
про ДР Джастина - я полазила по буржуйскому фандому, кроме фраз типа, ме не знаем когда у джастина др, ничего толкового не нашла
водительское удостоверение, которое запостила в обсуждении фика ula всплывало как-то, причем с утверждением, что это из съемочного реквизита... я в общем-то в это верю, и как ни смешно, в основном из-за ляпов на нем, типа не соответствующей фотке и карему цвету глаз)) (фанатки в своем творчестве такого просера не допустили бы, особенно касаемо цвета глаз, имхо)) а вот коулип вполне могли, тем более, что видимо это и не планировалось использовать крупным планом и
но в общем-то это все домыслы, если у кого есть какая инфа или соображения по этому поводу, буду рада услышать) потому что... кто считает, что оно в декабре, кто-то в ноябре, причем согласно таймлайну первого сезона, и я тупо не понимаю пока, как это у них выходит)
а да, вот оно удостоверение читать дальше
теперь что касается таймлайна, я сама никогда не вникала, отчасти лень было, отчасти и не хотелось, потому что я уверена, бреда и нестыкачей там навалом) довольно часто упоминается например беременность мел, не раз ее пытались рассчитать и состыковать со всем остальным
и пока я сегодня лазила, наткнулась на такое вот хм... иссследование darla-isabelle.livejournal.com/1792.html, читать даже еще и не пробовала, оно устрашающей длины, и естественно на англ), и даже не уверена, хватит ли у меня заинтересованности это осилить, но пусть будет))) хотя мож там и полная чушь)
помятуя, как исчезают впезапну сайты и журналы, запощу его сюда целиком
читать дальше
I was bored today so I decided to clean up my hard drive a bit and I found this little essay on the Queer as Folk timeline from a year or so ago. I never got around to posting it anywhere because I didn’t have an LJ then and the discussion boards I did know were pretty much dead by the time I found the show, so once I’d typed it up and gotten it out of my system, I forgot all about it.
As questions on the matter seem to pop up here regularly though, I figured I’d throw it out here now. Enjoy or shake your head.
Preamble & Season One
I’d been thinking about the continuity issues and trying to make things work for some time, but these parts of two commentaries by Gael on Refugee are what got me going on this little epic:
“Dear Continuity Squad: Season 3 is now over and it’s safe to come back from vacation. You have no more work to avoid. And since CowLip themselves wrote the Finale as usual, I guess we must ask THEM also to go back and review their own television series and familiarize themselves with what has actually occurred on it. I know that’s a lot to ask, but I do it and I’m not even getting PAID to get stuff correct! So, Jason Kemp, AKA Dumpster Boy, was murdered on April 11, 2002 according to the ad from “Concerned Citizens for the Truth” (AKA Brian “Rage” Kinney). That was Episode 2.10, the one where the future Rage goes a bit psycho himself. Except - that episode seems to have taken place in the fall of 2001. In 2.07 Lindsay and Mel are out raking leaves, so it must be fall, and then in 2.09 everyone is wearing heavier coats. And right after the finding of Dumpster Boy, there’s the White Party and the redundant Lesbian Wedding in Episode 2.11, when it is winter. Then in 2.12 Deb and Jennifer try to find out Dumpster Boy’s name as they scramble around snowy streets. This is a while after the murder, yet Horvath says nothing about the investigation being suspended because it obviously wasn’t. In fact, the case is on the Open Board, as Debbie points out to Carl. Then comes the supposed simultaneous birthdays of Ben and Justin (not to be confused with Justin’s OTHER birthday when he turned 18 in Decem-ber 2000, Episode 1.14). And since Ben has stated that he’s a Pisces, that would make it mid-March at the very latest. Then there is 2.17, Spring Break, and canceled snowboarding in Ver-mont - and it STILL can’t be April of 2002 yet. So if Jason Kemp really WAS killed on April 11, 2002 - then in what year did those things that came afterwards take place? I mean, even with the S3 Finale, we have NO fcking clue as to what month it is. A few episodes back Ted’s compu-ter stated that it was February 2, 2003. But other fans insist that it must be November 2002 - or is it 2003? - because of the Election. Or is it actually one year after Rikert, AKA Psycho Cop, resigned, as the “Concerned Citizens for the Truth” ad states, making it the coldest, snowiest MAY in Pittsburgh history? We have NO clue. The anniversary of the prom has gone by at least once without mention, we have no idea how long Justin and the Plot Device were shacked up, and Gus’ birthday must have passed as well - Gus has to be way beyond two years old now. Liberty Avenue truly MUST be Oz, where Time has no meaning - except when it’s vital to the plot (those Trimester things don’t just happen out of the blue!). Sort of.”
“Oh, one more thing. Vic died in February, which means that Brian found out he had cancer and had his surgery in February. Figure about four weeks of radiation treatment, so it’s probably late March. What football league plays its games in March? It CAN’T be fall already. What year IS it again? And how long has Mel been pregnant? Fifteen months? Twenty? Is she having an elephant? I’m just asking! CowLip’s Continuity Squad has been on permanent vacation since S1, but now it’s getting ridiculous. Outlining the plot ahead of time would help, guys. Or looking at a calendar now and then. The viewers are willing to suspend disbelief, but only to a point. Continuity is already a joke among dedicated fans, but now even casual viewers like my sister are asking, “WTF? What season is it supposed to be?” This isn’t merely sloppy planning, it’s almost willful flaunting of the Laws of Time and Space. Unless this is “Queer as Folk: The Sci-Fi Version”?”
So, here’s my take on the subject. It’s based on what actually happens on the show more than on the dates we are given every now and then, so when in doubt, I usually dismissed the ‘official’ time. I don’t really feel bad about that, as they’re so often out of the blue or worse, contradicting each other, that it’s practically necessary if you want the final product to make any sense.
(I’m sorry to base this mostly on what happens with Brian and Justin, but that’s what I remember most clearly – I’d have to re-watch everything thoroughly in order to get it correctly and detailed for the other characters as well.)
Okay, enough of the prologue, here goes.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
I’ll keep my commentary on season one short, as that was pretty obvious and coherent. Episode 1.01 first aired in December 2000 and was supposed to be set at the start of the new school year, so I guess we can say the general consensus is that it starts out in early September 2000.
From there we watch as the weather gets colder, the leaves fall, pumpkins appear for Halloween, Lindsay’s obligatory two months maternity leave near their close, and when Michael announces in 1.13 that ‘it’s December’ it mostly just confirms our own calculations. After 1.14 there is a break for (possibly the P-Town trip), Christmas and New Year’s, after the Leather Ball ‘a couple of weeks’ go by in which Brian – and everyone else, apparently - doesn’t see Lindsay, so by the time Michael and David get back from Paris in 1.17 we’re well into February, probably past Valentine's Day.
I’d say there’s another gap between Brian’s father’s funeral in 1.19 and the King of Babylon contest in 1.20 – the latter taking place on March 31. according to the poster – which places the prom firmly in mid to late April 2001.
Nothing new there.
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Season Two
There have been many complaints about continuity and the unclear time frame of season three, but I actually think these continuity problems already start with season two. The trouble here is not so much that it doesn’t make sense in and of itself, but that it throws over pretty much everything we learned in season one, which was pretty clear and straightforward. Just a few examples....
The second season already starts fucking up the time line at the very beginning with Gus’s birthday. I mean, Gus’s birth in 1.01 was supposed to be in early to mid-September 2000, right? Now let’s do a little math: As far as we know, the prom took place in April 2001, let’s be generous and say it was late April. Then we have two weeks in coma and a month in rehab – makes it mid-June when Justin got out of the hospital in 2.01. There is enough time for him to run off and see Brian, for them to get comfortable enough together again that Brian drops by Jen’s condo to see Justin and help with his physical therapy, for Jen to ask Brian to leave, for Justin to get impatient and confused and go to see Brian again, figure out what happened and freak out, for his problems to get bad enough for Jen to reconsider and ask Brian to take him, for Justin to move into the loft, for Brian to ask for help and for a few failed attempts to get Justin’s memory back.
What do you say how long that took? Two or three weeks at the very most? So we have early July 2001 now. What were they celebrating, Gus’s name-day? The anniversary of the baby shower? And it’s not even that they just scratched a couple of months off the calendar; there are still two summer holiday episodes before college starts in 2.05 in what would be the beginning of September 2001, right? Still not quite time for Gus’s birthday just yet.
To be picky: In 2.03 (I decided it’s late July or early August now, so Pride can be mid to mid-late August to fit with 2.05 being the beginning of September – Justin also seems to be a bit better now – back in public and working at the diner) Mel and Linds say it is their first year on the GLC board – but when they mentioned being on the board in 1.06 (mid-October 2000) it sure didn’t sound like they were new there. I know it still fits when their first year is nearly over now, but it still seems a bit off to me to mention it now. Not exactly sure why.
(Oh and I guess the annual two week Novotny outing to the Poconos took place in the few weeks between 2.02 and 2.03? Or they skipped it because of circumstances? The year before it must have been skipped in favor of Italy as well. Or it wasn’t invented yet? Yeah, probably that one.)
Episodes 2.06 to 2.08 don’t seem to cover more than a few days each, without gaps worth mentioning between them - and I also don’t recall any information contradicting what we already know – Michael meets Ben, Ted sets up JerkAtWork, Emmett becomes a porn star and meets George Schickel, the girls are planning their marriage and trying to get the Petersons’ support, and Justin sets up the rules and breaks them - so nothing really to say here in terms of time and continuity.
Then comes 2.09 and Joanie. Jack’s funeral in 1.19 was supposed to be in, well, some say around Valentine’s day because some drugstore had some flowers on display, personally I always figured it was more like early March; anyway, the point is that it was in late winter. 2.09 is supposed to take place in the fall – when 2.05 marks the beginning of September, it must be October by now (maybe the leaves were falling early that year). Brian has to be told that Joan is drinking more since Jack died, so I guess that means he hasn’t seen her in the seven months since then. So why would Brian say the last time they met was on Christmas? I mean, I could come up with some explanations if I wanted to. Like... it was some kind of nasty inside joke that being finally freed of Jack must be like Christmas for Joanie. Or him. Or both of them. After all, he also told Claire that Joan’s increased drinking must mean she’s celebrating, so it could be more of the same here. Or maybe... it’s just that Christmas is usually the only time he shows up at his ‘home’ (to torture himself for a bit) and he’s telling his mother that he has no intention to change that? But then, what about Joan’s remark that she won’t see Brian for another six months? Christmas is only two months away, isn’t it?
I mean, ignoring Brian’s comment (which I’ve decided to do), it would kind of fit with the actual timeline, tell us that this is probably the rhythm of their meetings (twice a year, when something is up), and also tell us that Joanie doesn’t actually expect to see Brian on Christmas. Cause counting both their remarks and taking them at face value would mean it’s June now, and that doesn’t make any sense at all. (Even though it would fit with the ‘Flag Day’ remark, but I refuse to take some cheap joke into consideration.)
(How come we’ve never had a Christmas or other holiday on screen anyway, even if only mentioned in passing?)
Next we have Jason Kemp’s murder in 2.10 and the wedding and White Party in 2.11. I looked up the official site of the Miami White Party and it apparently takes place in mid to late November (at least now), so it almost fits. (I can still pretend that seven years ago it used to take place in late October or early November, right?)
So... Debbie identified Jason Kemp in 2.12, what we’re supposed to believe was about two weeks after 2.10 and obviously shortly before the case was closed for ‘lack of evidence’. Was Rikert going to Stockwell a reaction to his victim being identified and panicking, and Stockwell didn’t know anything about what happened while the crime was initially investigated?
2.13 actually brings up two... well, let’s say questions. The first one is about Justin’s college tuition, which his father refuses to pay for anymore. I looked up some colleges and apparently tuition for the spring semester is due on December 1. – but with the possibility of monthly payments. I decided that Craig informed Justin – or rather, Jen – on very short notice in mid November, so Justin has time to play the go-go-boy for a good week or two before coming to his senses and accepting Brian’s help just on time. (I like that theory, please don’t confuse me with facts – that is, if you can talk of facts in the QAF-world.)
The second, much more convoluted one is the sudden appearance of Michael’s real father – including the moving of his birthday. Michael’s 30. birthday in episode 1.11 was in November, right? (I distinctly remember Michael himself stating that it was December only two episodes later, reacting to Emmett’s See The Light ‘Spring cleaning’ in 1.13; and I still trust those kinds of comments from season one. Come to think of it, he should be turning 31 right about now.)
So according to that, Michael would have been born in November 1970. And now we are supposed to believe that it was in March 1970? Not only does that not make sense with the established timeline that existed in the first season, it would also make Michael more than a year older than Brian (who was born in April 1971 last time we heard about it [1.22]) instead of just a few months – they wouldn’t even have been in the same year at high school. Unless, of course, Michael had to repeat a year, which doesn’t seem too unlikely. Still, why couldn’t Danny have left town just after the prom – that is in April, right? Even if Debbie already suspected or probably knew by then – she was sixteen or seventeen (and Catholic) and might not have worked up the courage to tell him - or anyone else – yet, so it would be at least just as believable as ‘he stayed over the summer after his graduation because... whatever.’ (At least, I assume he graduated. Did Debbie? What were the conditions/possibilities for pregnant high school students at the time?)
Then we have 2.14 with Justin’s acceptance of Brian’s financial support, George Schickel’s death and Debbie’s date with Horvath, and 2.15 with the comic book disaster, so according to my timeline it’s around mid to later December by 2.16 – which for once actually fits with something established in season one: It’s Justin’s birthday again. (I’ve decided to discount the Pisces [Feb 20. – Mar 20.] information about Ben – you can’t believe everything they say on this show anyway or it would make even less sense, especially timeline and continuity-wise.)
We then skip Christmas 2001, New Year’s Eve (both: again!) and obviously January (with the Police Ball mentioned in 4.11) and February (with a presumably ignored Valentine's Day) as well, as it is already spring break in 2.17. I looked up the current academic calendars of some colleges and apparently, Spring break is in early March. Apparently there is still snow in Vermont then.
(I considered that Brian may have misspoken and meant Christmas or winter break, but that didn’t seem to make too much sense in the big picture either so I decided to go with the flow this time. Even though I think that after two months the comic and birthday debacles should have been resolved and not still linger so near the surface for Justin. Then again, we’re talking about Brian and Justin here.)
But there’s still another problem: The other characters’ storylines seem to pick up pretty much where they left off as well, so there’s no real evidence for such a big gap. Like: Emmett finds out about his inheritance from George only now? And Ben seems to be okay with his new cocktail (the one he got after his birthday) so far. How long does it take to have a bad reaction? (Ok, the Pisces thing would probably fit here... how inconvenient.) Maybe Brian and Justin just live in another time zone than anybody else. Just like we always suspected.
2.18 obviously starts a week after 2.17 ended. Brian’s job sucks right now, Justin participates in a student art exhibition that Brian apparently doesn’t have time to visit (even though I sometimes wonder whether Justin told him about it in the first place, seeing where their relationship stands right now – he might be afraid of another disappointment); Ben collapses and is in a critical condition for some time before being released from the hospital; and Emmett loses the inheritance. So by the end of the episode it must be at least mid March 2002.
I suspect that the affair with Ethan goes on for a week, or maybe two at the most (I don’t base that on anything, really) before 2.19 starts (end of March) and then everything seems to happen really fast. I don’t think it’s much later than early April 2002 by the end of 2.20. (So theoretically, the snow while Ethan plays in front of the diner should be the last one for at least six months. From now on, I will ignore the weather for the time being.)
(Also, Debbie brings up the summer outing for the first time when she invites Ben to join them – it doesn’t really matter that it seems to be a bit early to bring it up the way she does because it’s never mentioned again.)
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Season Three
Continuity troubles seem to start big time with season three, so I will try to make some semblance of sense of that. (A pre-requisite of that seems to be to discount everything to do with the weather, which I’m determined to do – it’s not my fault that they seem to be shooting only in winter. I mean, not even Toronto can be covered in snow all year, right?)
3.01 covers the week following the Rage party, ending with the day or day after Mel and Linds’ eighth anniversary party (which would put their seventh anniversary somewhere around 1.21/1.22, so I guess it’s not too surprising we didn’t hear about it with everything else going on then); and in 3.02 Justin starts worrying about his tuition – which should be due by May 1. for the summer semester 2002. (Brian’s 31. birthday and the prom anniversary should fall in about that time – why was Brian already 31 in 2.18 again?)
(Also: I thought Mel and Linds were the first ones in their group of friends to have a kid and now Dusty’s already having her third? As far as I remember she wasn’t even the one who had one in 1.13 – and she seems to have been babysitting Gus from rather early on, so she can’t really be that new of a friend either.)
3.03 has the annual Center Carnival I can’t remember having heard of before (ok, alright, the last one would have happened while Justin was in coma so it actually fits this time) and the beginning of the steroid storyline; 3.04 has nephew John, and Ted and Emmett moving in together; and 3.05 starts the Stockwell storyline and the decline of Justin and Ethan’s relationship.
All of those seem pretty straightforward, so I go with roughly a good week per episode (including in-between-episode time) again – so it should be mid to late May now.
By 3.06 Justin seems to have had some time to (talk himself into believing to?) accept Ethan’s decision and be supportive and happy for him over the first concert he’s booked for, while Stockwell starts to interfere with the non-family-friendly aspects of Liberty Avenue. With 3.07 pretty much starting the following morning and apparently not covering more then two or three days, I’d say it’s early June now. Meaning, in my world Justin was with Ethan for about two months. (And unless the baby comes very early, it should be born in early March 2003.)
In 3.08 there are two references to time that don’t contradict each other: Ted hasn’t been out ‘for weeks’ and Justin has been depressed for the entire ‘first month’s rent’ – so I guess it’s save to say it’s July by now. Also, Lindsay is finally back to work, meaning that – apart from the few weeks she and Melanie were apart in season one – she was home with Gus for two months short of two years.
(So has the Novotny clan been to the Poconos sometime in that month? Sorry, I don’t know why I keep coming back to that darn family vacation. Oh, and Pride should have fallen in that time, too - unless it's supposed to happen in late August like the previous year, but we don't hear anything about it then, either.)
In the following episodes, for the rest of the season really, the characters keep dealing with the same storylines: Ted’s giving up and drug addiction with Emmett reacting to it, Mel’s pregnancy and how it impacts her professional and domestic life, Ben and Michael dealing with Hunter and Brian and Justin dealing with Stockwell.
What this means for me in terms of building a timeline is that for one, there are no greater gaps between the episodes to take into account (like recovering from steroids before taking in a hustler; or finding out what you want now in contrast to what you expected before, before going for it), so we can more or less see the episodes in ‘real time’ – I’d say about a week to ten days for each.
Roughly six to eight weeks from early to mid July would be somewhere between mid August and mid September. Taking into account the trimester thing it must be early September in 3.14. And we’re still in 2002.
Gus is about to turn two (yes, Brian says he’s two in 3.07, but it’s June then and what’s three month, right? Or did Gus even keep his season two birthday of early July?) and Brian and Justin’s second anniversary is coming up with it - maybe that was when they decided they were partners; Justin was suspended right before the start of the fall semester of his second year, which would have been paid for by August 1. (just before Brian lost his job) and Hunter went back to high school pretty much at the beginning of the new school year. (I think he might have gone to school part time while he was still living with his parents despite the hustling and also before he ran away from foster care, so maybe he didn’t completely miss several years.)
(And: are mayoral elections always in November everywhere in the US or does it vary? Maybe the former mayor had to retire earlier for some unknown reasons and it wasn’t even a regular election year?)
(That also makes Daphne’s mid-terms in 3.12 her summer finals – has Justin finished his classes and handed in his projects? Possibly before he started the internship? And did he get any intermediate reports from Vangard after working the time required for every single one of the three credits he needed before he got fired? After that he obviously wouldn’t have gotten any credits from PIFA at all, but they may have come in handy later. Sorry, I digress.)
I know I’m ignoring pretty much all the dates given but really: how could you not? For example, Ted’s e-mails in 3.10 are allegedly from February 2. This date may show hints of continuity in a purely later-season-three-referring-to-something-we-may-or-may-not-have-accepted-from-season-two context, as Brian was mentioning Justin's birthday like it wasn't too far away in 3.09, and that was supposedly in February or March (Pisces) then; but then in 4.07, it’s supposed to be February again. But from 3.14 to 4.14 it’s only six months (the time Ted is sober). And from 3.07 to 4.14 it should be nine months (Mel’s pregnancy).
[Actually, Stephmck brought it to my attention that you have to be pregnant for at least a month before it shows on a test, so theoretically it should be only two months from 3.07 to the end of the first trimester in 3.14, one of which would be consumed by the gap between 3.07 and 3.08. I don't think that it's realistic for the whole second half of the third season to have taken place within one month. On the other hand it also doesn't seem that between the end of 3.05 - Michael delivering his sperm - and 3.07 - the confirmation of the pregnancy - a month or more passed; I don't think it was more than two weeks at the very most. So we came to the conclusion that CowLip have no clue what they're talking about and wanted us to believe that Mel found out she was pregnant after hardly a couple of weeks, and I'm now consciously ignoring biology in favor of a sensible timeline.]
Same for the dates in the anti-Stockwell ad. They are precise dates, but they don’t make any sense at all. Jason Kemp was killed in April 2002? The investigation stopped and Rikert retired in May 2002? And now it’s May 2003? In season two it was pretty clear that the murder happened in later October 2001. Maybe it was cold-cased about a month later – after Debbie got them a lead by finding out his name and Rikert confessed to Stockwell? - and yes, that’s now nearly a year ago, but where they got the dates is beyond me. (Oh, I know: When they were shooting the anti-Stockwell ad for 3.14 it was April/May 2003 and as the crime took place last season, it must have been a year ago. That seems to be the way of thinking on several occasions....)
So what are we to make of all that? Well, what I make of it is that: The writers, CowLip, TPTB, whoever is responsible tell their stories in about real time pace, but then forget that they only covered a few months. When they come back for the next season, or even only were away for a certain number of episodes, they somehow think that every season covers a whole year – so as the series started in September 2000, an episode close to or at the end of the third season must logically take place in late Winter or Spring 2003 – no matter how much time actually passed within the story. (Could you say they mix up external and internal story time? That sounds so...educated? Or maybe telling time and told time. Whatever the phrase is.)
So when you want to know what time it is in the story, you pretty much have to ignore all the references to actual dates, as they seem to refer to real life time more than story time. References to time frames seem to be slightly more reliable, at least when they’re not about several years like Mel and Lindsay’s anniversaries.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
And here comes the second part:
Season Four
I guess while I’m at it I could just as well go on for the remaining two seasons – even though they seem to be slightly less confusing.
According to Deb in 4.01 it’s been three days since Michael ran off with Hunter in the season three finale, so there’s no gap worth mentioning between these to seasons either. In 4.02 Debbie’s tells Ted that she’d ‘love to stay for the whole seven days’, so however credible or incredible such a speedy release may be, it’s a week from 3.14 now – about mid-September 2002.
In 4.03 the whole Pink Posse business starts and Brian finds office space, and in 4.04 Ted is in his sixth week of rehab – a good five weeks after 3.14 would be about early to mid October and about three weeks after 4.03 – enough time to more or less set up Kinnetik.
4.05 marks the end of the Cody arc and Kinnetik getting started seriously, and then there seems to be a little gap before 4.06: Ben can’t find a publisher for his new book, Mel’s case is over, Emmett has moved in with Debbie and she still isn’t talking to Vic, Justin – and his relationship with Brian – have recovered from the Pink Posse, and Kinnetik has had a very a very successful start and is paying enough already for Brian to repay his debt to the community. I’d say... about four weeks? Which makes it... mid November. 2002.
(I guess we could make it four months just as well – that would fit with Vic dying in February. Except that it seems a bit long for Vic and Deb to be at odds. And would make Mel’s pregnancy really long. So personally, I’ll stick with the four weeks. Oh, and Mel and Linds’ first wedding anniversary and Michael’s 32. birthday would also fall in this time.)
4.06 starts lightly and relaxed, the office party goes well, a Hollywood director states interest in Rage, Brian and Justin hang out in Babylon to celebrate while Brian still tries to get Justin to go back to school. Then suddenly we have Vic’s death, Brian’s banishment from Debbie’s house and the discovery of a lump while winning his bet to bring Justin back to school.
In 4.07 Brian is trying to deal with the cancer while Justin is back at school. That in itself isn’t really a problem – he was only suspended and the condition for his being allowed back is invalid now that Stockwell is ‘indicted’ – but it’s rather late in the fall semester (damn yes, it is!) so... he sure wont get any credits this term. But at least he’s back. It’s a start. (I guess he can sit in on classes he’s not sure he wants to take to see what they’re like and read up on subjects he knows he will take in the spring semester so maybe he can take more courses then and make up for some of the lost time. And work on general, non-class-bound projects. Whatever.)
As for my take on the February Christmas: I know on Vic’s gravestone (in 4.09) it says it’s 2004 already, but well, it also says he was born in 1951, which doesn’t make sense in any way, shape or form – not that that’s even possible at this point: On the one hand, Vic was supposed to be involved in the Stonewall riots and the first Pride march in New York while he was there working as a pastry chef and fully living the nightlife. Stonewall and Pride took place in 1969 and 1970 respectively, and to take an active part in the events – not to mention making his own living in Greenwich Village - I would expect him to be at the very least of legal age to hang out at the bar in the first place. Which means he should have been born in the mid to late 1940s.
On the other hand, Vic is supposed to be Debbie’s younger brother – and by several years if she was mothering him in their childhood already. Hm, let’s see... Debbie had Michael in 1970 (at least the year seems to be steady, even if the month varies) when according to episode 3.10 she was 17. That would make her year of birth 1953 - and Vic’s somewhere in the mid to late 1950s accordingly. Maybe someone noticed the mess, decided 1951 would be a good compromise and hoped no-one would notice. (And additionally: In 1.03, wasn’t Vic supposed to be born in 1952 according to his Babylon membership card?)
So with all that, I don’t really see a reason to put any more stock in his year of death – let alone the month. It seems to me that they ‘needed’ to give us some actual date, so they - again – referred to what time it was in real life instead of what would make sense story-wise.
By the time Brian gets back from Baltimore in 4.08 I expect it’s early December. A few days till Brian finds out Justin knows and kicks him out, another few days (4.09) till Justin gives up for the time being and the radiation treatment starts, and another few days in which Mikey gets rejected, clues Justin in to Brian’s motives and Justin gets back to the loft to stay.
Then we skip another few weeks – Justin’s 20. birthday, Christmas and the turn of the year; as well as the remainder of Brian’s radiation treatment and Justin getting him through it. I guess by 4.10 it’s about mid January 2003. (And I have just learned that there are even still football games until the end of January.)
By 4.11 I think at least another two weeks or so have passed – Brian seems to be better and can make jokes about ‘withholding sex’ again already.
4.12 follows rather seamlessly and then we supposedly have a three week gap before 4.13 (illogical as it seems that Justin would wait that long to find out what Brian was up to). So according to my personal timeline it’s later February by now and we've conveniently skipped another Valentine's Day. Calculating that 4.13 and 4.14 cover less than a week each it’s still early enough in March for Jenny Rebecca to be born a week or so early. (When ‘the baby isn’t due for weeks’ before the guys left for Toronto was supposed to mean two weeks or so....)
So in my world, season four ends in early to mid March 2003, which means season five should pick up in fall 2003.
[Actually, going with this timeline for Ben and Michael’s marriage instead of believing CowLip’s ‘Liberty Ride 2004’ unfortunately clashes with reality, as same-sex marriage wasn’t legal in Toronto/Ontario until June 2003, (first Canadian province to decide that, nationwide legalization July 2005), but I think I’ll overlook that….]
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Season Five
Hm… season four ends in March, when Keller has just gotten the green light for the Rage movie and now has to get the sсript written and actors cast and whatever else is necessary to prepare a movie, giving Justin some more time in Pittsburgh (in which he can finish the Spring semester) and putting his departure in about mid-April, probably leaving just before Brian’s 32. birthday and staying in Hollywood for a good six to seven months – long enough to see the apparent second extension coming -, so season five picks up in about early to mid-November 2003.
In contrast to the earlier seasons, season five as an entirety doesn’t really seem all that close-knit; although we also had some jumps here and there in seasons one to four, in season five it seems that such jumps are the rule instead of exceptions: most new developments – and there are some – in one episode seem to have a lot of time to become established matters of fact, even routines, before the next episode starts, indicating that some time has gone by, but making it hard to judge how much time actually passes during one, let alone between episodes.
Let’s start at the beginning. In 5.01 Ted informs us that Kinnetik has been in business for a year – which fits pretty well with the launch party in 4.06 – and allegedly it’s the girls’ 10. ‘being together’ anniversary – when the date fits so much better as their second wedding anniversary. (And their break-up would have happened about a month before their 9. anniversary.) Brian gets moody about (another?) extension of Justin’s absence and is half-heartedly searching for a new ‘toy’, finally going overboard and actually acquiring Babylon, and Justin enjoys Hollywood and making his vision become real. And then suddenly the Rage movie gets cancelled and the dream is over. In the meantime, Ben and Michael debate buying a house, and Michael should also be turning 33 somewhere around here. They also find out that Mel and Lindsay have been separated ever since Jenny’s birth and Michael throws himself in that righteous indignation that leads him right into the custody battle.
I give this episode at least a week, and another one between episode time, clearing out the studio, getting all the required contracts and licenses for Babylon signed, getting all Debbie and Horvath’s stuff back to Debbie’s house….
5.02 seems to start at the beginning of the week, leaving a few days to the re-opening of Babylon on Friday. Justin, after finally accepting that the Rage movie is definitely and irrevocably dead, seems to be back in Pittsburgh a day or two after that. Ted starts feeling old and unattractive and fights it by getting his hair bleached; and Michael gets a lawyer.
Then there seems to be a gap for Thanksgiving; and in 5.03 Emmett starts his new job as the Queer Guy, gets cancelled and then re-installed; Mel meets with her lawyer, decides her chances are better without Lindsay there, so Brian gets Linds her own lawyer and finally the custody hearing takes place; and after a few false starts, Babylon is ‘back on top’ again, while Justin still doesn’t have any specific plans for his immediate future other than that it doesn’t include school or the Liberty Diner.
5.04 seems to start at the very verge of Christmas – apparently, it’s been about four weeks since Justin moved in with Brian again, (obviously Justin’s comment about the four years doesn’t work with my estimations) – but neither that nor Justin’s 21. birthday or the turn of the year are mentioned; and the new year 2004 starts all shiny with the arrival of the custody decision. Michael doesn’t like it, accuses Brian of not being his friend and stops talking to him, he moves into the new house with Ben and doesn’t even show up at Brian’s piece offering of Hard Heroes Night even though Brian went to his dinner party. Debbie is already bored with staying at home, Ted takes off of work for ‘ten days tops’, and Justin works on getting a painting included in the Emerging Artists show at Lindsay’s gallery. I’d say by the end of the episode, it’s easily mid- to late January.
Then Michael, Mel and Linds get into a routine of passing Jenny Rebecca around and bitching at each other while Ben and Michael get comfortable in suburbia and Michael still refuses to talk to Brian. So 5.05 probably starts well into February, having Brian deal with syphilis - what a lovely Valentine's Day gift, Justin starting to think about what he wants in a relationship in the long run, while the custody situation escalates before finally getting resolved. Also, Deb has to deal with Loretta, and Ted with the results of his surgery.
I’m not sure how much time passes between episodes, but by 5.06 Debbie is back at the Diner, Michael and Justin have produced a new issue of Rage, and Hunter went from never wanting to go back to school again to the point of leaving Ben and Michael. Brian has to deal with the arrival of a new ‘hot stud’ and rejection, blowing it completely out of proportion and alienating Justin further. I’d say it’s at least mid, possibly even late March when the episode ends.
Let’s say 5.07 starts about two weeks later – Michael and Ben’s relationship is suffering from the loss of Hunter, and Proposition 14 has made its way to everyone’s awareness and is being fought with every available weapon. Lindsay moves in and out with her parents, Justin finally leaves Brian, camps out at Michael and Ben’s house and then finds his own place, Brian has another fight with Michael, bans Brandon from Babylon and then gets into a bet with him – and celebrates another depressing birthday we don’t hear about.
5.08 has the conclusion of the bet, Mel dating Corinne, everyone fighting Prop 14, Craig having Justin arrested and Drew contacting Emmett again. It’s hard to give an exact time frame, but I’ll go with more than a week.
By 5.09 Brian and Michael haven’t spoken for weeks and even Deb feels it’s time to intervene – I guess it must be at least mid-May by now. We learn that Jen has been in a relationship for the past six months (that’s since around the time Justin came back from Hollywood), and the Emerging Artists show finally takes place. Michael still refuses to make up with Brian; and Drew finally comes out. I’d say a good week for this episode as well, making it late May.
By 5.10 there’s a benefit planned, organized and about to happen that we haven’t heard about before and Ted is getting impatient and desperate to find someone to marry. I guess it’s mid-June by now. Brian is the first year cancer free and donates Babylon to host the benefit. I think the episode itself covers only several days, and 5.11 starts the morning after the explosion. The vigil is held the next day, Michael is recovering nicely, the police finish with Babylon, and Brian finds and buys a house and eventually convinces Justin to marry him. (And unless we go with 2.04 and assume that in QaF Verse Pittsburgh Pride is in late August, it should be right around the corner.)
By 5.12 Michael is out of the hospital and seems reasonably fine, Hunter is working at the Diner, Drew’s team is begging him to come back and they win the next game, Brian and Justin send out their announcements and plan their marriage at a rather exclusive location, the girls decide to move to Canada, Drew goes to explore his new freedom, and Ted meets Tad. And so passes another month.
When 5.13 starts, Ted has been with Tad for three weeks, so it must be mid-August 2004 now. The Human Rights Panel asks Michael to speak at some conference (where he finally gets that not everyone has to want the same things), Hunter passes what must be summer courses and can go on to the new school year with his class (and turns 18), Ted breaks up with Tad and celebrates his birthday with Emmett, and Brian and Justin decide not to get married. And then everyone leaves for new adventures. It seems fitting that it’s the end of summer.
I know that the final official date we were given was on the wedding invitations, where the commitment ceremony was announced for April 16. 2005 and the RSVP asked for by April 1. 2005. I think the year doesn’t bear too much weight in the context of building a sensible overall timeline, as there didn’t pass nearly as much time between the end of season two and the end of season four as was generally assumed later on, but the month could probably fit if one wanted it to. We don’t really know how much time Justin actually spent in LA, and the timeline I worked out for season five also leaves room to be tightened up. I just like it better this way.
As for Ted’s age, I know Ted said he was 33 in 1.11 (Nov. 2000), but even if I went with the so called official timeline – what there is of one - and have it be April 2005 now, he would still only be turning 38. As his age was only mentioned in a through-away remark in season 1, while being a major story point in season 5, I have decided to go against my usual practice and dismiss the season 1 date in favor of this later one and have Ted being born in August 1965, making him 35 years old in Season 1, and adding my own piece of continuity: according to Emmett in 4.14, Ted’s birthday really is in August. (Ok that doesn't seem to fit so well with the ski trip, but aren't there some mountains that are covered in snow year round? Up in Vermont, maybe?)
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
@темы: timeline, queer as folk, загадочно QAF, интересности QAF
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15.11.2010 в 10:16-
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15.11.2010 в 10:31впрочем, эээ как-то наверное сейчас мир БиДжи существует в голове уже совсем самостоятельно, даже независимо от серала) так что)
Такой подход более, чем непрофессионален.
ну, у меня как-то язык все ж не очень поворачивается обвинить их в непрофессионализме... я лучше спишу, на условность в искусстве)
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15.11.2010 в 10:44мир БиДжи существует в голове уже совсем самостоятельно, во, у меня та же фигня. Причем так - есть БиДжи, для меня абсолютно реальные и живые, а есть актеры - тоже реальные, но совсем отдельно. Разделяется без проблем.
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15.11.2010 в 10:57-
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15.11.2010 в 11:06-
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15.11.2010 в 12:37ну это вообще общее место, когда сталкиваешься в статьях, фильмах, книгах с той областью, в которой что-то понимаешь)) полная беда))
candygram почитала я про таймлайн- совсем офигела, лучше бы не читала.
ну я примерно так и подозревала, по тем отрывочным сведениям, что мне раньше встречались)) что мозги расстыкуются (с) )))
И саш, спасибо большое, было напряжно, но занимательно.
пожалуйста)
reda_79 Я когда-то пыталась понять про даты рождения Брайана и Джастин, но потом плюнула на этот вопрос... Запуталась нафиг.
единственное, что понятно точно, что у Джастина ДР не летом)))
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15.11.2010 в 12:41-
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15.11.2010 в 12:50эммм... тут тоже... в одном из скриптов ДР тортика-памятника из 122, стояла же дата, 21 мая 1971)
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15.11.2010 в 12:55-
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15.11.2010 в 12:59Тогда понятно откуда запредельное упрямство.
reda_79 , авка СУПЕР!!!!
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15.11.2010 в 13:06-
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15.11.2010 в 13:08-
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15.11.2010 в 13:09Лягуха - просто радость для сердца и глаза.
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15.11.2010 в 13:22-
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15.11.2010 в 13:26-
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15.11.2010 в 13:36-
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15.11.2010 в 13:43-
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15.11.2010 в 13:52Саш я тебе все лягушками заполонила)
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15.11.2010 в 18:18